45 Days Later ... Relic drop rates are absurdly low regardless what happens in 0.36

Here’s hoping there’s no regrets with this statement :thinking:

Or what? You’ll get angry? Or worse?

It’s one thing to be highly passionate about a topic. It’s totally another thing to imply a threat to the devs about said topic. The emoji in your post does not help matters here, either.

Your post is is an example of why Salty and the other devs have an standard operating policy of not providing broad timetables about when updates are planned to be released to the community. You’re burning the goodwill bridge that Salty built with the post you are quoting to the ground for the PQ3 community.

Please don’t salt the earth here before the game is even formally released.

Wow. I call attention to something you yourself acknowledge is a practice they tend to avoid (this has been said repeatedly), so I think it’s fair to bring attention to the comment and state the obvious; the fact that there was a timetable given is something that I’m sure they hope they can meet or yet again they will regret making such a statement. The fact that you come on here and imply that I’m making threats is just once again evidence of your wish to make me out to be some sort of menace.

Thanks for trying though.

P.S. @Salty - Feel free to address this issue and the apparent threats that @Lyrian has tried to imply that I am making. I’m really tired of this personal campaign that he is waging against me for simply calling out a statement that you yourself have said that you don’t like making. There is nothing sinister about calling attention to the communications shared on this forum. You chose to make it. I am simply reminding people that it was made. It’s called accountability, not threats.

Do you not understand what you are doing?

Leaving out the “or else…” part of the a threat does not make it any less of a threat. You, nor me, nor any normal user on this forum has the power to hold Salty or any of the devs “accountable” for anything.

I completely cannot comprehend what explicit or implicit authority you could possibly have over the development team to make such statements to be able to enforce accountability over them.

At this point, I’m petitioning @Salty , @Cyrup , or @Jeto to perma-lock this thread. There’s literally zero productive value this thread could possibly have anymore.

The authority I have is that of user of a product that the makers’ of said product want me and others to continue using. If the makers of a product continually overpromise and underdeliver, the player base can choose to stop accepting what they say as being reliable and choose to migrate to a different product. I am not beholden to you about continuing to hold product makers accountable for their statements. The fact that you view this relationship as one of compulsory fandom is your choice.

Also, you literally have an entire community of players who have been repeating this time frame given here in game chat for weeks now. Do you think that there will not be repercussions in terms of player reaction if they don’t deliver the update? Stop trying to trap me into some sort of “gotcha” threat to make yourself out to be some sort of forum hero and look at what the actual playerbase is saying.

Finally, the main thrust of this thread has been for my part about the paucity of drop rates of Relics/Glyphs and the misleading information that was disseminated about introduction/changes to these items per the patch notes. It’s been acknowledged since that the “sytem” that was introduced was a partial implementation that left core elements of the game essentially unplayable and that communication about this was poor. Furthermore, it has been two months in which the game has remained in this state. Within this thread a communication about this issue and the timeline was brought up by the Community Manager.

YOU @Lyrian have been the individual on this thread who has made it personal, unproductive, and quite frankly acrimonious. Every time I do my best to continually respond to your implications with facts and you continue to make insinuations like you have some sort of school yard grudge.

I think these folks are lucky that you are not an actual community manager given your behavior. But should you prevail, I guess it would be because of some relationship you have with the community personnel since nothing here would merit it other than your consistent efforts to create a fire where there is none.

Yes, everyone is hungry for some sort of major update to arrive. That is indisputable.

To pass judgment on an early access game that everyone knows is incomplete? That’s unreasonable.

In last week’s mini-update, Salty stated that part of 0.36 was going to include a dungeon rework, which was not previously mentioned to be in the update. This was something that you, personally, have been championing in this very thread since it’s beginning. Would you rather them potentially rush out this update and possibly screw up the dungeon rework just because they had to commit to some vague statement Salty made multiple weeks ago?

And what would happen if exactly that just happened? Would you make another thread demanding accountability from the devs because the rework was rushed/wasn’t ready to make an arbitrary timetable?

The active daily player base has gone down by over 50% the last month, almost entirely because of changes in version 0.35.

Some portion of them will never be back.

It was one of the most dysfunctional patches I have ever seen in any game. It essentially removed (at least temporarily) multiple systems from the game for nearly 2 months.

Some of these include the entirely of the ascending system, any reasonable use for food aside from in guild wars for the only limited resource they can be used on each day, any reasonable use for gold since things prior that sunk gold are nonexistent in 0.35, any way to reasonably get progress towards upgrading followers as the current time to max in this patch is longer than the system they had prior (was 2 years before and is 3 years in the current state of 0.35), a mana bug that makes anyone with a % mana start that doesn’t have a bone ring essentially be stuck in a near unplayable state, among a few other detrimental things that have been unchecked for 2 months.

There is also a concern that 0.36 will address very little of the issues, or leave many of the issues in the game for yet another 2+ months.

On the topic itself of relics, I likely have one of the biggest top 10 resource piles in the entire game, yet am still at only 25% of the way to ascending 1 item in 2 months. Prior to the patch, it was around 1 per week, normally a rare to epic, but sometimes uncommon to rare.


I guess it’s better that you are insinuating about my future postings instead of insinuating that I’m making threats. I’m not into reading tea leaves. For myself, I will continue to evaluate game content that actually exists and provide comment about such rather than constantly make assumptions about what someone else is thinking, saying, or will do in the future. Given that broad statements are made all the time about upcoming content, I have no view as to what I’m going to say about something about which virtually no information is currently available.

Perhaps. Some of these things have already been said to be fixed with the update. Others, are yet to be seen.

0.36 very well may completely rewrite a whole bunch of core game mechanics again. I wouldn’t be surprised if at some point the game adopts GoW’s starting mana mechanic (only the single strongest source applies) to address Turn 0 PvP wins and Turn 1 PvE looping. I severely doubt the devs are going to allow events to be cheesed in the same way level 100 dungeons currently are.

The devs have been doing more prep work behind the scenes for the upcoming update. There was a stealth server push on Friday that made some significant changes to other systems in the game that were not dungeon related. Kind of surprised that no one made a thread commenting on the changes. Personally very curious about the “other shoe to fall” regarding these changes when the update lands.

Since you have all the information, feel free to illuminate the issue. I look forward to the thread.

I’m still waiting on independent verification from Lyranica on the changes I asked her to verify today (to confirm that my findings are not some weird bug that is only affecting me), which should happen tonight, before possibly commenting on the changes I found. However, as I have a certification examination at 8 AM tomorrow morning and then a full work day afterwards, don’t expect any threads from me on the changes anytime soon.

I don’t really follow this. You’ll forgive me if I just can’t keep up with the shifting landscape of your commentary.

Last comment of the night from me.

Why do I even bother responding back to you?

That would be because I am still trying to determine if the observations I am observing should be classified as a bug report or feedback for discussion. Doing so generally requires independent observation to verify or debunk hypotheses.

After tonight’s discussions, Lyranica suggests at least one more night’s worth of observations on her end before she can say that she has verified what I wanted her to test. Of course, by then, 0.36 may be out and these observations may be part of the update notes. That said, we did not find anything that disproved my observations tonight. She just wants to see additional confirming data, which is entirely understandable.

One point, which I will go out on a limb and say is probably a thing that has happened is that certain crafters received significant boosts to their production quality. The scope of crafters and amount of the boost requires additional data to verify. I’m suspicious the crafters that received the boost are the ones that produce upgradable things (gear/spells/minions), while the other crafters were left untouched. This is just an educated guess interpreting where the data seems to be pointing right now on this topic.

And with that, I’m out for the night. Do what you want with information, or not.

Well that certainly would be interesting, although it’s doubtful you could have reasonable precision in your results after 2 days of data collection. I have about 1+ month of collection data that I have been performing for Upgradable Gear Crafters + Mutiny. I’ll be interested in comparing results!

If the crafts are for keys, armor, weapons, accessories or tickets… mine have all tanked since the mini update. Not saying they were nerfed. Random gonna random, but that goes both ways.

I have gotten 3 wooden keys from lvl48 Eveline since that update, and zero throughout the rest of 0.35


Given the acrimony that have been stirred in this thread in response to a legitimate issue (Relics as implemented in 0.35), I thought I would put a capstone on this commentary with some reflections as a result of the 0.36 Update (surprisingly, they are mostly positive!)

As addressed previously, my main concern (beyond the patch note delivery) was that with the number of relic types introduced (60!) and the amount required to evolve items (4 every rarity beyond Uncommon!), whatever systems were introduced in 0.36 would be inadequate to allow players to reasonably over time evolve gear. Thankfully, the developers clearly understood the same issue and put in a much needed change:

This is pretty big! I want to be very clear throated here: This is a good change and I think goes a long way to mitigating the issue. I understand that Glyphs will still be a sore point, but I’ve always assumed these were going to be costly and rare and we will see what changes are in store down the line. But as it pertains to Relics, this change is good to see. One concern I continue to have on evolves: the midrange runes/scrolls, particularly the epic rarities are hard to target and at the rate that they are collected could very well end up being more of a challenge to collect than the Relics for desired evolves over time. Better ways to target specific rarities without having to do lesser level content would be good; the ability to use higher rarity versions of the same runes/scrolls for equal or lower rarities I think would be better.

What about the concern that Relics would be locked behind a “drip” system and there would be no way to acquire them outside of that system which would render doing non-event content less rewarding? Indirectly, I think they took a good step to addressing that as well. I had originally assumed when they confirmed that Relics would show up in Daily Deals that they would be priced in gems/crowns currency only. Given the “conversion rates” previously calculated I was not optimistic about the gems prices. However, much to my surprise, the majority of Relic offers in the Daily Deals so far seem to be denominated in gold and at reasonable values per rarity. Given that gold is an infinitely farmable resource, this goes part way to addressing this concern; the ability to “farm” for Relics outside the event system. Is it ideal? No; I still think rates on relics should be increased from Dungeon completions as a way to be more targetable (especially in light of the changes to “Difficulty”). But I appreciate this approach and helps to not only provide additional Relics from “farming” (non-Event/Challenge play) but also provides a reasonable use for gold which was absent pre-0.36.

There are many other issues that 0.36 has brought about that need to be addressed, but for this specific issue I would like to acknowledge the changes that were made as a positive step.


O hai! Time to open 1000 more chests to test this new rate! :crazy_face: