45 Days Later ... Relic drop rates are absurdly low regardless what happens in 0.36

I’m going to add a bit more response because I’m pretty confident I listened to the stream just as well as @Lyrian did, so since he wants to discuss the stream further, I look forward to hearing his commentary and evaluating his opinions. In the meantime …

Personal Observation: Sirrian said specifically that early access has been great for the game. Doesn’t sound like he’s filled with regrets.

Fair point! He did not say the word “Whoopsie”. Instead, at 29:15 in the stream in responding to this question: “It’s frustrating that upgrading gear was basically made impossible with no interim workaround (like Dungeons) added in the meantime. Was it considered to add a temporary means of adding relics until the introduction of Challenges?”, Sirrian responded by saying: "I hear what you are saying, it’s a bit frustrating about upgrading the gear, that’s kind of what I was touching on earlier about the relics, and it’s an early access thing, we hit some versions and get them out … the relics went in without the drip feed of the relics going with it and that was unfortunate and I apologize for it … it was just a product of being early access and we want to umm … it will be there in the next update and you will be able to get the things that you need in a more regular fashion and if they are not coming to you quick enough we will be able to see that in the data and we will be able to up the appearance rate of them"

Please feel free to check my transcription. Ultimately, we have the promise of a “more regular fashion” being introduced, but previously we were also told that relics were able to be acquired through Dungeon completions (how many have you found?). So you will forgive me if I’m skeptical about the effect of the “more regular fashion” mentioned. If the new mode is going to be completely event locked and completions will only be able to occur at a known daily rate, what additional data is needed then to be observed? What are the variables involved? Do you get to select the evolve currency you receive or is it random. They have this information; we don’t. And therefore I will continue to discuss it because I think it’s worth talking about as we evaluate how they plan to allow the players to play the game. Clearly we have already influenced the conversation around this and perhaps provided feedback that challenged them to think about what they offer players. I think that’s a good thing.

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::wince:: Seriously. :woman_facepalming:

This is not a “people expect the finished game” issue. It’s an unfortunate communication blunder. Blunders happen. They do. Especially via written communication. They happen in all directions also. (I blunder several times a minute) No shame. Literally one word out of place and kablooey!

I happen to think it was all addressed well in the stream. Neither Steve, nor Salty explicitly said that the patch notes were just wrong, but I personally don’t need that. This isn’t the Hague! :rofl: As they say… nobody died.

Looking forward to 0.36!

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To be fair, I went to great lengths to say that the patch notes were wrong as they regard Relics :sweat_smile: I do, however, agree that no deaths were caused by the patch notes. :wink:

EDIT: Sorry @Tresk I see what you mean now :laughing: :+1:

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Nonono… My fault. My writing was awkward there!

I was trying to say that during the stream, neither Salty nor Steve flat out said that the notes were just wrong.

I will edit my comment for clarity.

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@Sibelios or Nopolin? Sorry I couldnt resist. Everyones entitled to there opinion and I’m with you Sib! It’s more like should waited 6 months and release a functioning game JUST SAYING! =)

And yes I know its BETA

After about 33 days, I finally found my 1st relic!

A lucky rabbit’s foot off of a level 100 ruby. Still none off of level 100 diamonds despite running 20x as many of them.

Even once the primary method for obtaining relics is added to the game, their drop rate from chests is WAAAAAAY too low.

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Congratulations, we are now tied on our 33 day drop rates! Solidarity!

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Checking in with some data. Yep, still just 1 relic in 35 days.

download (1)

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Hopefully the next update is within the next day. It has to be pretty soon at this point. This week’s Monday/Tuesday or next week’s Monday/Tuesday seems rather inevitable for it.

Hopefully it doesn’t break more than it fixes like last update. XD

I would cheerfully welcome something totally broken at this point. Ok… no cheer! :eyes: :rofl: But the complete nothingness for a month is just not cool. As a tester (which is what we are) there isn’t even anything new to evaluate and report. At least if there was a borked update we could document that for a bit.

So my humble advice to the team is (as my late father in law used to say) “Do something… even if its wrong.”

Oh Noplin how I love you lol

In another nearby thread, one poster’s screenshots are not like the others… :thinking:

At least that one poster can actually take a joke unlike some.

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There shall be no joking on specified threads. All sarcasm must be properly noted and documented. Any deviation from this will result in passive aggressive treatment to the offending party…

Just for some clarity, a month between updates is considered a very short span of time. We need to design, implement, test, fix, and add any design changes and bug fixes. On top of that it needs to pass certification, so a month turnaround is very rare and often impossible in game dev. (It gets even worse with multiple platforms, and we are also working on bringing early access to more in the near future which is also taking some time. It’s also worth noting that server side fixes and changes are easy to push, but major updates and major bug fixes happen client side, and must pass platform certification or they cannot be released.)

We are hoping to release 0.36 within the next few weeks. Hopefully it’s earlier, but just in case anything happens I’ll say it’s within the next 3.

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Thank you for the sharing of information
I’m looking forward to the update - Noting of course that they would be subject to change without notice just having some guidance on expected/hoped for timeframes is very welcome

What I find disappointing is that my personal forum hall monitor has not once addressed the actual substance of my ongoing complaint but instead wishes to scold me for my manner of addressing the issue. Feel free to provide an actual defense that the 0.35 drop potential for relics/glyphs (regardless whatever the future 0.36 “drip” may be) were not misleadingly communicated and that they are reasonable rates that should be maintained going forward. The issue of relic/glyph drop rates is not a bug due to the unfinished state of the game; it’s a choice made by the developer with all the available information about future rates from other modes. 0.36 will not “fix” the issue; any data “gathered” post 0.36 will not be about the rates of evolutions and possible tweaks to drop rates but rather the rates at which players are purchasing relics/glyphs as a result of the acquisition constraints. It continues to be communicated that Relics can be acquired from Dungeon completions and that Glyphs are easier to acquire than before. The reality is that actual relic drops from Dungeon completions are so statistically insignificant as to be non-existent and glyphs are seemingly unchanged in their rates.

Even this graphic is stupidly misleading: an extra chance to obtain a specific relic at virtually 0% is still 0%

For argument’s sake, I will be generous and suggest that the drop rate of a relic from a chest is 0.5%. So far, what little evidence of drops exists suggests that they are obtainable from gold+ chests. So your chance of getting a relic from a dungeon run are currently 0.0031%. You need to complete an average of 645 dungeon runs to obtain a relic. The fact that most people have gotten what few relics have been found from non-dungeon chests (mark-bought chests opened by minions, quest/sidequest chests) supports these facts as people are more likely to be openings these types of chests rather than dungeon chests. Completing Dungeons is not a means to obtain a relic. Even opening chests of any source is not ultimately a means of obtaining a relic. And don’t forget, you need 4 of the lowest level Relic to evolve an UNCOMMON to a RARE. I’m pretty sure that these numbers go beyond any reasonable definition of “very rare”.

So everyone please stop reframing this issue as an exercise in patience for the 0.36 update. To assist I have renamed the thread to be more clear.

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You are not incorrect and I believe you have articulated the issue clearly

  • Relic drop rates are so low as to be virtually non-existent (plus you need 4 of a specific one to be able to use it)
  • The patch notes were inaccurate at best, misleading is another possible interpretation

Now that’s done, other than waiting for the 0.36 update (or some hotfix for drop rates, which was specifically and explicitly declined by the devs during the recent stream) - What else can we as a community do that is constructive?

I honestly don’t know so am very open to ideas. I believe a focus on constructive ideas with positive outcomes are something that we can all benefit from

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I believe in constructive feedback as well. I would argue that I have done my best to contribute to that effort on several submissions. My specific issue here is that I don’t believe that at the end of the day that the problem has been addressed; if anything the response has been a lukewarm, sorry, that’s the way the way early access goes sometimes. But this is not an issue of early access bugs. This was a deliberate choice to present a “solution” as favorable to the players and to provide information to guide players’ understanding of the current game state. But it’s inaccurate; if you are a new player looking to start playing and you read the patch notes to get current with the game state, you are clearly misled. We know this because of the daily questions: “Where do I get an Altar Candle?”, “How can I find a Rabbit’s Foot?”, “I’m trying to get Ghoul’s Hands but I can’t seem to find any. Am I doing something wrong?”. And of course the answer to all these questions is: “You don’t find them. Stop looking”.

That’s a problem. There’s an easy fix. Amend your communications. It’s not hard.

I would be happy to never respond to this thread ever again. But I get tired of the constant deflection that things will work out once the next update hits. Think of it as a bug report: “What are you expecting to happen?” “I am expecting to find Relics through Dungeon completions”. “What is actually happening?” “No one is finding Relics through Dungeon completions”. The existence of other future modes of attainment don’t resolve the issue that essentially a communicated means of something occurring doesn’t occur… At least with salvage, the rate, albeit defined as a “small chance”, is expressly defined. You can even increase it and see the increase reflected in the tooltip! So either fix the rates to match the description or fix the descriptions. Go back and state clearly that actually relics are found in chests but its not just “very rare”, it’s extremely rare, exceedingly so. Amend the graphics to remove the suggestion that the relics exist as drops. If you looked at that dungeon rewards graphic and wanted the broadsword, and you ran the dungeon 500 times and never got a broadsword, you would have a problem with that.

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If I may chime in a bit related to this relic drop rates…
What happened with 0.3.5 update really makes me hope that one day in all countries in the world, the legislation which requires the devs to state the ACCURATE drop rate and percentage to obtain items from any loot box in any game will be applied so that everything that the devs do behind the scene (like adjusting the drop rates of certain rarity items on the fly) will be transparent to all the players.
Hopefully such legislation will exist sooner than later so that all these messy situation in any loot box game (not just PQ3) can be avoided - well at least that way the devs would have to find for loopholes to do it - and hopefully finding them won’t be easy.

Well just a wishful thinking from a mere ordinary player…

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